The Seven Earths & Their Existence and their Location


It may come as a surprise to some of our readers to find that the Qur’an teaches that Allah created seven earths.

“It is Allah Who has created seven heavens, and earths as many …” S. 65:12, F. Malik’s translation

What should we understand these seven earths to be? Earth in the sense of a land mass, i.e. seven continents located on our one planet earth? Other planets similar to our earth? Before we can evaluate whether this Quranic statement is true, i.e. decide about its scientific correctness, we need to clarify the exact understanding of these ‘seven earths’, particularly how Muhammad understood them. The teaching on the seven earths is found in the early Islamic data, the ahadith and commentaries on the Qur’an.

Evidence from the Ahadith

Sahih Al-Bukhari

Narrated Muhammad bin Ibrahim bin Al-Harith:

from Abu Salama bin ‘Abdur-Rahman who had a dispute with some people on a piece of land, and so he went to ‘Aisha and told her about it. She said, “O Abu Salama, avoid the land, for Allah’s Apostle said, ‘Any person who takes even a span of land unjustly, his neck shall be encircled with it down seven earths.’” (Volume 4, Book 54, Number 417; see also Numbers 418, 420; Volume 3, Book 43, Numbers 632-634)

Narrated ‘Abdullah:

A (Jewish) Rabbi came to Allah’s Apostle and he said, “O Muhammad! We learn that Allah will put all the heavens on one finger, and the earths on one finger, and the trees on one finger, and the water and the dust on one finger, and all the other created beings on one finger. Then He will say, ‘I am the King.’” Thereupon the Prophet smiled so that his pre-molar teeth became visible, and that was the confirmation of the Rabbi. Then Allah’s Apostle recited: ‘No just estimate have they made of Allah such as due to Him.’ (39.67) (Volume 6, Book 60, Number 335)

Sahih Muslim

Muhammad b. Ibrahim said that Abu Salama reported to him that there was between him and his people dispute over a piece of land, and he came to ‘A’isha and mentioned that to her, whereupon she said: Abu Salama, abstain from getting this land, for Allah’s Messenger (may peace be upon him) said: He who usurps even a span of land would be made to wear around his neck seven earths. (Book 010, Number 3925; see also Numbers 3920-3924)

Al-Tirmidhi

Narrated AbuHurayrah

While Allah’s Prophet (peace be upon him) and his companions were sitting clouds came over them and Allah’s Prophet (peace be upon him) asked, “Do you know what these are?” On their replying that Allah and His Messenger knew best, he said, “These are the clouds (anan), these are the water-carriers of the Earth, which Allah drives to people who do not thank Him or call upon him.” He then asked, “Do you know what is above you?” On their replying that Allah and His Messenger (peace be upon him) knew best, he said, “It is the firmament, a ceiling which is guarded and waves which are kept back.” He then asked, “Do you know what is between you and it?” On their replying that Allah and His Messenger (peace be upon him) knew best, he said, “Between you and it are five hundred years.” He then asked, “Do you knew what is above that?” On their replying that Allah and His Messenger (peace be upon him) best he said, “Two heavens with a distance of five hundred years between them.” He went on speaking like that till he counted seven heavens, the distance between each pair being like between Heaven and Earth. He then asked, “Do you know what is above that?” On their replying that Allah and His Messenger (peace be upon him) knew best, he said, “Above that is the Throne, and the distance between it and the (seventh) heaven is the same as that between each pair of heavens.” He then asked, “Do you know what is below you?” On their replying that Allah and His Messenger (peace be upon him) knew best, he said, “It is the earth.” He then asked, “Do you know what is under that?” On their replying that Allah and His Messenger (peace be upon him) knew best, he said, “Under it there is another Earth with a journey of five hundred years between them,” and so on till he had counted seven earths with a journey of five hundred years between each pair. He then said, “By Him in Whose hand Muhammad’s soul is, if you were to drop a rope to the lowest earth it would not pass out of Allah’s knowledge.” He then recited, “He is the First and the Last, the Outward and the Inward, and He is omniscient.” (Tirmidhi commented that Allah’s Messenger’s recitation of the verse indicates that it would go down within Allah’s knowledge, power and authority, for Allah’s knowledge, power and authority are everywhere, while He is on the Throne, as He described Himself in His Book.)

Ahmad and Tirmidhi transmitted it. (Number 1513- taken from the ALIM CD-ROM Version)

Note: This hadith is particularly relevant, since the reference to the seven earths is this time not made in passing while talking about some other topic. It is Muhammad himself who takes the initiative to teach his followers the structure of the universe. The ‘fact’ that there are seven heavens and seven earths is already stated in the Qur’an. Muhammad, however, wants his followers to know also what the relation is between these seven heavens and the seven earths, what exactly is their relative position and the distance between them.

Narrated Ubayy ibn Ka’b

In regard to the words of Allah, the Exalted and Glorious, “Your Lord brought forth their offspring from the loins of the children of Adam.” (7:172) Ubayy said: He gathered them and paired them then fashioned them and endowed them with the power of speech and they began to speak. He then made an agreement and covenant with them. He made them bear witness about themselves (saying) Am I not your Lord. They said: Yes. He said: I call to witness seven heavens and seven earths regarding you …

Transmitted by Ahmad. (Number 41- taken from the ALIM CD-ROM Version)
Narrated AbuSa’id al-Khudri

Allah’s Messenger (peace be upon him) said that Moses asked his Lord to teach him something with which to make mention of Him or to supplicate Him, and was told to say, “There is no god but Allah.” He replied to his Lord that all His servants said this, but he wanted something particularly for himself, and He said, “Moses, were the seven heavens and their inhabitants, apart from me, and the seven earths put on one side of a balance and ‘There is no god but Allah’ on the other, ‘There is no god but Allah’ would outweigh them.”

It is transmitted in Sharh as-Sunnah. (Number 731- taken from the ALIM CD-ROM Version)
Narrated Ya’la ibn Murrah

Ya’la told of hearing Allah’s Messenger (peace be upon him) say, “If anyone wrongly takes a span of land, Allah, Who is Great and Glorious, will make him dig it till he gets to the end of seven earths, and then he will have it tied round his neck till the Day of Resurrection when men are judged.”

Ahmad transmitted it. (Number 885- taken from the ALIM CD-ROM Version)

Fiqh-us-Sunna

… Ata ibn abi Marwan states from his father that Ka’b took an oath by the One who opened up the sea for Moses that Suhaib related to him that whenever the Messenger of Allah sallallahu alehi wasallam saw a city which he wished to enter, he would say: “O Allah, Lord of the seven heavens and what they shade, Lord of the seven earths and what they carry, Lord of the satans and those that they misguide, Lord of the winds and what they blow away, I ask of You for the good of this city and the good of its inhabitants and the good of what is in it. I seek refuge in You from its evil and the evil of its inhabitants and the evil of what is in it.” This is related by an-Nasa’i, ibn Hibban, and al-Hakim who calls it sahih … (Volume 2, Number 119b- taken from the ALIM CD-ROM Version)

… Khalid b. Walid reported that once he suffered from insomnia. The Prophet, peace be upon him, said to him, “Shall I teach you words that will make you go to sleep when you say them? Say, ‘O Allah, the Lord of the seven heavens and whatever they cover, Lord of the earths and whatever they contain, Creator of devils and whomever they mislead, be my protector from the evil of all Your creatures lest some of them may hasten with insolence against me or transgress the bounds. Honored is he who is in Your protection and blessed be Your name, there is no god except You’.” (Reported by At-Tabrani in his Al-Kahir and Al-Awsat. Its chain is sound, although Abdur-Rahman did not hear it from Khalid. Al-Hafiz al-Mundhari has mentioned it)… (Volume 4, Number 122- taken from the ALIM CD-ROM Version)

Evidence from Early Muslim Historians and Commentators

Tafsir Ibn Abbas

(Allah it is Who hath created seven heavens) one above the other like a dome, (and of the earth the like thereof) seven earths BUT THEY ARE FLAT. (The commandment cometh down among them slowly) He says: He sends the angels down from heaven with revelation, Scripture and calamities, (that ye may know) and acknowledge (that Allah is Able to do all things) relating to the dwellers of the heavens and the earths, (and that Allah surroundeth all things in knowledge) and that His knowledge encompasses everything.’ (Tanwîr al-Miqbâs min Tafsîr Ibn ‘Abbâsonline source; bold, underline and capital emphasis ours)

Al-Tabari

According to Muhammad b. Sahl b. ‘Askar-Isma’il b. ‘Abd al-Karim-Wahb, mentioning some of his majesty (as being described as follows): The heavens and the earth and the oceans are in the haykal, and the haykal is in the Footstool. God’s feet are upon the Footstool. He carries the Footstool. It became like a sandal on His feet. When Wahb was asked: What is the haykal? He replied: Something on the heavens’ extremities that surrounds the earth and the oceans like ropes that are used to fasten a tent. And when Wahb was asked how earths are (constituted), he replied: They are seven earths that are FLAT and islands. Between each two earths, there is an ocean. All that is surrounded by the (surrounding) ocean, and the haykal is behind the ocean. (History of Al-Tabari-General Introduction and From the Creation to the Flood, Volume 1, trans. Franz Rosenthal [State University of New York Press, Albany 1989], pp. 207-208)

Ibn Kathir

<and of the earth the like thereof.> means, He created seven earths. In the Two Sahihs, there is a Hadith that states …

In the beginning of my book, Al-Bidayah wan-Nihayah, I mentioned the various narrations for this Hadith when I narrated the story of the creation of the earth. All the thanks and praise is due to Allah.

Those who explained this Hadith to mean the seven continents have brought an implausible explanation that contradicts the letter of the Qur’an and the Hadith without having proof. (Tafsir Ibn Kathir (Abridged) Volume 10 (Surat At-Tagabun to the end of the Qur’an), abridged by a group of scholars under the supervision of Shaykh Safiur-Rahman Al-Mubarakpuri [Darussalam Publishers & Distributors, Riyadh, Houston, New York, London, Lahore; first edition, September 2000], pp. 55-56; bold emphasis ours)

Muhammad ibn ‘Abd Allah al-Kisa’i

… There are seven earthsThe first is called Ramaka, beneath which is the Barren Wind, which can be bridled by no fewer than seventy thousand angels. With this wind God destroyed the people of Ad. The inhabitants of Ramaka are a nation called Muwashshim, upon whom is everlasting torment and divine retribution. The second earth is called Khalada, wherein are the implements of torture for the inhabitants of Hell. There dwells a nation called Tamis, whose food is their own flesh and whose drink is their own blood. The third earth is called Arqa, wherein dwell mulelike eagles with spearlike tails. On each tail are three hundred and sixty poisonous quills. Were even one quill placed on the face of the earth, the entire universe would pass away. The inhabitants thereof are a nation called Qays, who eat dirt and drink mothers’ milk. The fourth earth is called Haraba, wherein dwell the snakes of Hell, which are as large as mountains. Each snake has fangs like tall palm trees, and if they were to strike the hugest mountain with their fangs it would be leveled to the ground. The inhabitants of this earth are a nation called Jilla, and they have no eyes, hands or feet but have wings like bats and die only of old age. The fifth earth is called Maltham, wherein stones of sulphur hang around the necks of infidels. When the fire is kindled the fuel is placed on their breasts, and the flames leap up onto their faces, as He hath said: The fire whose fuel is men and stones (2:24), and Fire shall cover their faces (14:50). The inhabitants are a nation called Hajla, who are numerous and who eat each other. The sixth earth is called Sijjin. Here are the registers of the people of Hell, and their works are vile, as He hath said: Verily the register of the actions of the wicked is surely Sijjin (83:7). Herein dwells a nation called Qatat, who are shaped like birds and worship God truly. The seventh earth is called Ajiba and is the habitation of Iblis. There dwells a nation called Khasum, who are BLACK and short, with claws like lions. It is they who will be given dominion over Gog and Magog, who will be destroyed by them… (Tales of the Prophets-Qisas al-anbiya, trans. Wheeler M. Thackston Jr. [Great Books of the Islamic World, Inc., Distributed by Kazi Publications; Chicago, IL 1997], pp. 8-9)

Shaykh Al-Albani

The late renowned modern hadith scholar Al-Allamah Muhammad Nasir ud-Deen Al-Albani, after citing the following narration:

134 – “When death was approaching the Prophet of Allaah Nooh – sallAllaahu alayhi wa sallam – he said to his son: I will narrate to you my bequest; I command you with two things and prohibit you from two things. I command you with ‘La ilaha ‘illa Allaah’ (‘There is none worthy of worship in truth except Allaah) if the seven heavens and the seven earths were placed upon a scale and ‘La ilaha ‘illa Allaah’ was placed on the other, then ‘La ilaha ‘illa Allaah’ would be heavier… Silsilah Saheehah: 134

Stated that:

4 – The seven earths are like the seven heavens. There are many Ahadeeth regarding this in Bukharee and Muslim and in other books. Perhaps one day we will have time to follow up these Ahadeeth and research them. What supports these Ahadeeth is the saying of Allaah Tabaraka wa Ta’ aala : << It is Allaah Who has created seven heavens and of the earth the like thereof (i.e. seven). >> I.e. they are similar in creation and in number.

So, you should not pay any attention to the one who explains it away, there by it ends up as a negation of similarity as well as in numbers, being deceived by the Europeans and where their knowledge has reached to, from having gone up in to space however they do not know of seven earths, along with that they do not know about seven heavens. Will we reject the speech of Allaah and the speech of His Messenger due to the ignorance of the Europeans and others along with them, declaring that the more they increase their knowledge of the universe, the more they increase in their ignorance of it. Allaah the Most Great has spoken the truth when He said : << And of knowledge, you (mankind) have been given only a little >> (Al-Albani, The Ahadeeth of Tawheed from the Silsilah Ahadeeth As-Saheehahsource; bold and underline emphasis ours)

The preceding citations demonstrate beyond any reasonable doubt that the first Muslims, Muhammad and his companions, believed that there were seven actual earths. In addition, these sources conclusively prove that Muhammad taught all these seven earths, including the earth we live on, to be flat, something like a continental plate, but not spherical like a globe. (For further data, see the article The Earth: Flat or Round?). It is quite evident that Muhammad was grossly mistaken here.

One more important observation needs to be made about this issue:

It is Allah Who has created seven heavens, and earths as many …” F. Malik

Allah it is Who hath created seven heavens, and of the earth the like thereof …” Pickthall

Allah is He Who created seven Firmaments and of the earth a similar number …” Yusuf Ali

All these translations show that the emphasis of this verse is not the number of heavens and earths, the purpose of this ayah is clearly to answer the question: Who is the creator of the seven heavens and earths? That there are indeed seven heavens and seven earths is assumed. This is not new information. In the many ahadith quoted above, the fact that Muhammad specified the number of the heavens and the earths to be seven never evoked any surprise. It was the general understanding at the time, believed by many. In fact, in the second hadith quoted above, it is a Jewish Rabbi who comes to Muhammad and speaks of a plurality of heavens and a plurality of earths. The Qur’an only stresses, that the creator of them all is Allah, not any other of the many gods the Arabs still believed in at the time. He alone is the creator of all the earths, and therefore he alone has the power over all the earths. The rest of the ayah confirms this emphasis:

Allah is He Who created seven Firmaments and of the earth a similar number, through the midst of them (all) descends His Command: that ye may know that Allah has power over all things, and that Allah comprehends all things in (His) Knowledge.” Yusuf Ali

Conclusion

Taking into account all the early Islamic data presented above, is there any way to avoid the conclusion that the Quranic teaching about the universe as being structured in seven heavens and seven earths is merely a repetition of the beliefs and superstitions of the people of Muhammad’s day? The ancient belief in seven earths is a major scientific error and this false understanding was not only explicitly taught by Muhammad but even included in the Qur’an as if being a scientific fact. This provides further evidence that Muhammad is not God’s prophet, the Qur’an is not God’s word and that the Allah of Islam is not the true God.

19 thoughts on “The Seven Earths & Their Existence and their Location

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  2. just a question- do you have a scientific background?

    I dont see how you can claim that the seven earths idea is unscientific for the following reasons

    1) it is impossible to ascertain what the “seven earths” idea refers to- seven earths as in seven earth like planets, or perhaps a metaphor for some spiritual idea? Until you can actually ascertain what the seven earths are you cannot dissmiss the idea

    2) the majority of hadeeths stated are of duboius veracity with the exception of bukhari and muslim- and those hadeeths dont seem to relate to the seven earths idea very well at all.

    3)most importantly even if you could actually prove the meaning of seven earths how is this scientifically inaccurate? as i understand it earth like planets would have to reside within the goldilocks zones of their respective stars in order for liquid water to form but would you regard these planets as “earths”? would they contain life forms similar to those found on earth if at all? would they be of similar size and geology and would they follow a fairly circular orbit (not highly elliptic)?

    it is quite misleading to claim something as scientifically inaccurate when it does not contradict any well established theory that has gained wide credence.

    looking forward to your reply

    thanks

  3. Aslmwlkm, you wasted again our precious time. Kindly quote from Quran as that is the word of Allah to whom, to whom the entire Universe submits. Maybe that too is too tough for a fable mind to fathom?

    • Plum,

      I’ll sincerely request you to go through the article once again, and have a look, and then say, whether Quranic verses are used as an reference or not in this particular article. I don’t know how and why you deny Hadith of Prophet Muhammad, when he himself said to follow his Sunnah. For reference read this one:-

      “Say (Oh Muhammad): ‘If you (truly) love Allah then follow me, so that Allah may love you and forgive your sins.’ And Allah is All-Forgiving, All-Compassionate.” (3:31)

      “Say (Muhammad), ‘Obey Allah and the Messenger, but if they turn away, then Allah does not like the disbelievers.” (3:32)

      Further read 65:12, which says:-

      It is Allah who has created seven heavens and of the earth, the like of them. [His] command descends among them so you may know that Allah is over all things competent and that Allah has encompassed all things in knowledge.

      So, here Allah himself says that he has created Seven Heavens and Seven Earths, but I don’t know where to find those 7 earths, as this Earth is getting over populated..

      Regards

  4. Pingback: Heaven & Hell of Islam « The False Prophet

  5. Brother Zia,

    In your last comment you said, ” Brother Rahul, this is not the Tu Quoque fallacy…..I am just asking as well as giving u the example of what is the real degrading the of women….by killing them with they husband, treating them like a whore by give a wife to five husband (pandavas), or like ur lord Krishna marry or just taking pleasure from more then 16000 women , some time stole they clothes while they taking bath in lake to make the fun of them , and many many many more things ….this is called real MISOGYNIST OF WOMEN or WOMANIZER (like pandavas, Krishna , etc.,)”

    Well you keep denying but this is actually a logical fallacy, called Tu Quoque. This is because, certainly we are discussion Women in Islam, why you want the topic to be diverted into Women in Hinduism. Also if you need clarification about your queries then please visit the right person, and I admit that I am not the right one.

    Moving further, you said we are Islamophobes. OK, can you explain me how and what are Islamophobes?? Also you gave me some link, proving Islam is the fastest Growing religion. Well then you need to see these too:-

    http://www.bible.ca/islam/islam-myths-fastest-growing.htm

    http://wikiislam.net/wiki/Fastest_Growing_Religion

    http://www.webcitation.org/query?url=http://www.adherents.com/rel_USA.html&date=2011-04-16

    http://www.webcitation.org/query?url=http://www.bible.ca/global-religion-statistics-world-christian-encyclopedia.htm&date=2011-04-16

    These links are latest and will clear your doubts about world’s fastest growing religion.

    Regards.

  6. Hey Rahul, this is Syed Zia from google+ remember, by the way I thought u quit posting all this nonsense against Islam(what after i reply u , for exp: see down below) , but not ur doing really hard jihad (striving) to defame the religion of Islam, man for that effort I will really appreciate if its is in his true way ( not the wht u doing ) so, why u running away frm my reply’s why dont u answer my simple rebuttal why u hiding behind ur (Tu Quoque fallacy) excuse ,

    well for ur reminder I am reposting our conversation wich we did on Google+ ,

    zia syedJun 8, 2012

    Brother rahul raj , I think u have no knowladge abt ISLAM or WOMEN in Islam , u might b believe wht ever media say’s and think as its Islam , plz read the translation of Quran or ask the right person abt it , or CAN I HELP U!

    Rahul RajJun 8, 2012
    Thanks for your suggestion Sister ( I guess). But before commenting on my knowledge, you must read the link, which I have provided above. I have used authentic Islamic sources, and the English translations are from renowned Islamic scholars, approved by Al-Azhar University of Cairo, so there cannot be error.

    Anyways, I welcome your help, can you please help regarding following:-

    What is the real translation or interpretation of this authentic Hadith:

    Bukhari Volume 3, Book 43, Number 648:
    Narrated ‘Abdullah bin ‘Abbas:
    I had been eager to ask ‘Umar about the two ladies from among the wives of the Prophet regarding whom Allah said (in the Qur’an saying): If you two (wives of the Prophet namely Aisha and Hafsa) turn in repentance to Allah your hearts are indeed so inclined (to oppose what the Prophet likes) (66.4), till performed the Hajj along with ‘Umar (and on our way back from Hajj) he went aside (to answer the call of nature) and I also went aside along with him carrying a tumbler of water. When he had answered the call of nature and returned. I poured water on his hands from the tumbler and he performed ablution. I said, “O Chief of the believers! ‘ Who were the two ladies from among the wives of the Prophet to whom Allah said:

    Further, can you please explain me these two Koranic verses sis:-

    33.30
    O Consorts of the Prophet! If any of you were guilty of evident unseemly conduct, the Punishment would be doubled to her, and that is easy for Allah.

    31. But any of you that is devout in the service of Allah and His Messenger, and works righteousness,- to her shall We grant her reward twice: and We have prepared for her a generous Sustenance.

    zia syedJun 13, 2012

    I am a brother not sister (as u guess), and sorry for the delay i was little busy….. and i don’t think any of that translation (on ur link) is frm the QURAN and SAHI-HADITH.(I as far as i checked)
    and about that hadith, yes that is authentic and very long and its deal with lot of matters so, i don’t know which part the hadith u didn’t understand if u ask me which part u didn’t get so, i may b help u or my next answer will b (by the grace of ALLAH)
    

    zia syedJun 13, 2012

    As far as the this particular ayat’s of the
    Quran (33:30) “O Consorts of the Prophet! If any of you were guilty of evident unseemly conduct, the Punishment would be doubled to her, and that is easy for Allah.”

    Its doesn’t mean: God forbid, any chance of the Holy Prophet’s wives committing an indecency, but this was meant to make them realize that they were the mothers of the Muslims; therefore, their responsibilities were accordingly very high, and so their moral conduct should be the purest. (This is ,just like Allah’s addressing the Holy Prophet to the effect: “If you committed shirk, all your works would be rendered vain.” (Az-Zumar: 65). This also does not mean that there was, God forbid, any chance of the Holy Prophet’s committing shirk, but this is meant to make the Holy Prophet realize, and through him the common Muslims, that shirk, is a most heinous crime which must be guarded against most judiciously.)
    (“…..AND THAT IS EASY FOR ALLAH” : means), “You should not be under the delusion that your being the Prophet’s wives will protect you from Allah’s punishment, or that it will be difficult for Allah to call you to account on account of your high rank and position in the world.”

    (QURAN 33:31) “But any of you that is devout in the service of Allah and His Messenger, and works righteousness,- to her shall We grant her reward twice: and We have prepared for her a generous Sustenance.”

    The reason for giving a double punishment for a sin and a double reward for a good work is that those whom Allah honours with a high rank in society generally become the leaders of men and the majority of the people follow them for good or for evil. Thus, their evil does not remain their own evil but becomes the cause of a people’s degeneration, and their goodness does not remain them own goodness but becomes the cause of the true success of many other people also. Therefore, when they commit evil they are punished for their own as well as for others degeneration, and whcn they do good they are not only rewarded for their own good works but also for this that they guided others also to do good. This verse also gives the principle that the greater the degree of prohibition and trust in respect of somebody and something the greater and more serious will be the crime of violating that prohibition and trust and the greater will be the punishment for it. For example, drinking in the mosque is a much morc serious crime than drinking privately in the house, and therefore, it will entail a severer punishment. Likewise, committing adultery with the prohibited relations is a far morc serious crime than committing it with another woman, and therefore, will call for a severer punishment.

    Hope this will help u 

    zia syedJun 13, 2012

    By the way ur talking about WOMEN IN ISLAM which is highly honored and so much so a whole chapter was revealed in the name of WOMEN (Surah 4. AN-NISA) and plenty on SAHI-HADITH’S also speak about them (for example: paradise beneath under the feet’s of the mother) and so on and on….,

    But why don’t u check in ur religion HINDUISM (women in Hinduism should die with they husband when he die and its called SATI
    for example in (Garuda Purana 1.107.29)
    A wife who dies in the company of her husband shall remain in heaven as many years as there are hairs on his person.
    ( According to 2.4.93 )she stays with her husband in heaven during the rule of 14 Indras, i.e. a kalpa.

    Rahul RajJun 13, 2012

    Thanks for informing me your Gender, as I was confused because of your first name ZIA. Anyways lets move on to the reply. You said, “i don’t think any of that translation (on ur link) is frm the QURAN and SAHI-HADITH.” This is obviously wrong, because any one who sees this link:- http://mostintolerantreligion.com/women-in-islam/did-islam-improve-the-status-of-women/ can notice that all the references provided from authentic canonical scriptures of Islam.

    Further you asked me which part I have not understood. I will only say that the relevant part is posted in that article mentioned above, and I have understood that Hadith very well, but I am unable to understand, what you want to prove here, using that Hadith.

    The Hadith and below one is used to show how Islam did not elevated the status of Women, because from Omars own admission that “Ansari women had the upper hand over their men”. But what we find in Islam is not what Muslim claim. Now please read the following excerpt, which is the part of article and will help you understand what I want to say.

    The importance of this Hadith is in the fact that it proves that women prior to Islam had much more freedom, which was taken away from them by Muhammad and his misogynistic khalifas. It becomes clear that the deplorable status of women in Islam is not a divine verdict but a reflection of how women were treated in Mecca 1400 years ago.

    The fact that there is so much emphasis in Quran and in Ahadith about the importance of women being obedient to their husbands is indeed an indication of Muhammad’s own desire to control his young and rebellious wives. (See Q.4:34)

    The other important point of the above Hadith is that it reveals yet another sexual scandal of the prophet.

    One-day Muhammad goes to his wife’s house Hafsa the daughter of Omar and finds her maid Mariyah attractive. He sends Hafsa to Omar’s house, telling her that he wanted to see her. When Hafsa leaves, Muhammad takes Mariyah to bed and has intercourse with her. Meanwhile Hafsa, who finds out that her father was not expecting her, returns home much sooner than expected, and to her chagrin finds her illustrious husband in bed with her maid.

    She becomes hysteric and forgetting the station of the prophet she shouts and causes a scandal. The prophet pleads with her to calm down and promises not to sleep with Mariah anymore and begs her also not to divulge this secret to anyone else.

    However, Hafsa would not control herself and relays everything to Ayisha who also turns against the prophet and jointly with his other wives cause him much anguish. So the prophet decides to punish all of them and not sleep with any one of his wives for one month. Depriving one’s wives sexually is the second grade of punishment recomendedn in Quran. The first level is admonishing, the second level is depriving them of sex and the third level of punishment is beating them. Q. 4: 34.

    Of course when a man decides to punish a wife with sexual deprivation he can satisfy himself with his other wives. But Muhammad’s anger had made him make the oath not to sleep with any of them for one month. That of course would have been too much of hardship for the beloved messenger of God (peace be upon his immaculate soul), therefore God in his mercy came to the aid of his prophet and revealed the Surah Tahrim (Banning). In this Surah Allah rebukes Muhammad for being hard on himself and for depriving himself from what he really likes and has been made lawful for him, in order to please his wives.

    This is the text of the Surah Tahrim: 66:1-5.

    1. O Prophet! Why do you ban (for yourself) that which Allâh has made lawful to you, seeking to please your wives? And Allâh is Oft-Forgiving, Most Merciful.
    2. Allâh has already ordained for you (O men), the dissolution of your oaths. And Allâh is your Maula (Lord, or Master, or Protector, etc.) and He is the All-Knower, the All-Wise.
    3. And (remember) when the Prophet (SAW) disclosed a matter in confidence to one of his wives (Hafsah), so when she told it (to another i.e. ‘Aishah), and Allâh made it known to him, he informed part thereof and left a part. Then when he told her (Hafsah) thereof, she said: “Who told you this?” He said: “The All-Knower, the All-Aware (Allâh) has told me”.
    4. If you two (wives of the Prophet SAW, namely ‘Aishah and Hafsah turn in repentance to Allâh, (it will be better for you), your hearts are indeed so inclined (to oppose what the Prophet SAW likes), but if you help one another against him (Muhammad SAW), then verily, Allâh is his Maula (Lord, or Master, or Protector, etc.), and Jibrael (Gabriel), and the righteous among the believers, and furthermore, the angels are his helpers.
    5. It may be if he divorced you (all) that his Lord will give him instead of you, wives better than you, Muslims (who submit to Allâh), believers, obedient to Allâh, turning to Allâh in repentance, worshipping Allâh sincerely, fasting or emigrants (for Allâh’s sake), previously married and virgins. “

    Although Muhammad gave his word to Hafsa, not to have sex with her maid he could not resist the temptation. Especially now that he had taken another oath not to sleep with all of his wives. It was a difficult situation and no one but Allah could help him. Well, nothing is impossible when you are the prophet of Allah. Leave everything in the hands of the Almighty and let him take care of it. And that is exactly what happened. Allah himself intervened and gave him the green light to follow his heart’s desire. In the Surah Tahrim God licensed his beloved prophet to have his flings and not pay attention to his wives. What can a prophet ask more? Allah was so concerned about Muhammad’s carnal pleasures that he even allowed ALL MEN to break their oaths as a bounty. Alhamdulillah! AllahuAkbar! Subhanallah. Isn’t Allah great?

    Rahul RajJun 13, 2012

    Another thing brother Zia, that the verse you are explaining which is 33:30 is used in relation to verse 66:5 in the article, which cannot be ignored. I guess you have not read the article nicely, other wise you must not have explained the verse quoting Ibn Kathir, word for word.

    The article clearly says, “Anytime that the Prophet needed to say the ultimate word and make others shut up, he would make his Allah reveal a verse. He was an old man, having a harem of a score of wives and concubines. All his wives were young and beautiful. In his old age he became the chieftain and very powerful. So he could afford to marry anyone and some even came and offered themselves to him. He would choose only the pretty ones. But political power is not a substitute to physical stamina. The Prophet was fully aware of the age gap between his young wives and himself. He was jealous and would warn his wives to not betray him.

    33.30
    O Consorts of the Prophet! If any of you were guilty of evident unseemly conduct, the Punishment would be doubled to her, and that is easy for Allah.

    31. But any of you that is devout in the service of Allah and His Messenger, and works righteousness,- to her shall We grant her reward twice: and We have prepared for her a generous Sustenance.

    He would often remind his wives to behave in a way as not to attract the attention of other men and cover themselves so they don’t become desired by strangers.

    32. O Consorts of the Prophet! Ye are not like any of the (other) women: if ye do fear (Allah), be not too complacent of speech, lest one in whose heart is a disease should be moved with desire: but speak ye a speech (that is) just.

    33. And stay quietly in your houses, and make not a dazzling display, like that of the former Times of Ignorance; and establish regular Prayer, and give regular Charity; and obey Allah and His Messenger. And Allah only wishes to remove all abomination from you, ye members of the Family, and to make you pure and spotless.

    Are these verses from God or are the worries of an impotent aging man with a bevy of young and attractive wives?

    Muhammad needed to control his wives and that is the reason behind the Islamic veil. What was originally meant for the wives of the Prophet became part of the Sharia and is imposed in all Islamic countries.

    Muhammad repeatedly emphasized the importance that of women obeying their husbands. Did this have something to do with the fact that most of his wives were teenagers that he needed to control? His wives were uppity, as all teenagers are. To frighten them into submission he made his own wishes expressed by his imaginary friends in the heavens. Any time he had some domestic problems his Allah would rush to his rescue and reveal a verse or two to help him out. The following is to put all his wives in their places.

    “It may be if he divorced you (all) that his Lord will give him instead of you, wives better than you, Muslims (who submit to Allâh), believers, obedient to Allâh, turning to Allâh in repentance, worshipping Allâh sincerely, fasting or emigrants (for Allâh’s sake), previously married and virgins.” Q. 66: 5

    The truth that women in Arabia had more liberty and authority before Islam than after it can also be evinced from the fact that Khadijah, Muhammad’s first wife, had a business of her own and had many men at her service. Muhammad, was but one of her employees. Do we have any tale of women after Islam, running their own business and hiring men to work for them?”

    So now I think it answers all.

    Regards..

    Rahul RajJun 13, 2012

    Lastly, I would like to add the some more points, which I noticed in your reply. You said, in one reply, “This is ,just like Allah’s addressing the Holy Prophet to the effect: “If you committed shirk, all your works would be rendered vain.” (Az-Zumar: 65).

    Unfortunately brother, Allah is the one who has committed shirk, and deserves punishment, according to his own Qur’an and Sunna of his prophet. See here:- Does Allah Commit Shirk?

    And, I don’t need to reply your logical fallacy of Tu Quoque.. which you have used in your last comment, “But why don’t u check in ur religion HINDUISM (women in Hinduism should die with they husband when he die and its called SATI
    for example in (Garuda Purana 1.107.29)
    A wife who dies in the company of her husband shall remain in heaven as many years as there are hairs on his person.
    ( According to 2.4.93 )she stays with her husband in heaven during the rule of 14 Indras, i.e. a kalpa.”

    This is perfect example of Tu Quoque fallacy..

    zia syedJun 14, 2012

    Last thing first:::

    “And, I don’t need to reply your logical fallacy of Tu Quoque.. which you have used in your last comment, “But why don’t u check in ur religion HINDUISM (women in Hinduism should die with they husband when he die and its called SATI
    for example in (Garuda Purana 1.107.29)
    A wife who dies in the company of her husband shall remain in heaven as many years as there are hairs on his person.
    ( According to 2.4.93 )she stays with her husband in heaven during the rule of 14 Indras, i.e. a kalpa.”

    This is perfect example of ..”

    Brother Rahul, this is not the Tu Quoque fallacy…..I am just asking as well as giving u the example of what is the real degrading the of women….by killing them with they husband, treating them like a whore by give a wife to five husband (pandavas), or like ur lord Krishna marry or just taking pleasure from more then 16000 women , some time stole they clothes while they taking bath in lake to make the fun of them , and many many many more things ….this is called real MISOGYNIST OF WOMEN or WOMANIZER (like pandavas, Krishna , etc.,)

    (and y SCARED to answer my reply’s and quotes(abt Hinduism ) , if u r truthful ? )

    Actually brother Rahul , u and ur supporters(Robert,woods,sam ….,)on ur site r trying to propagating the “ISLAMOPHOBIA” and u guys failed miserably , boz …u can see prove down-hear …cont….reading

    http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/local/ct-met-religion-census-0502-20120428,0,1601511.story

    http://www.worldviewweekend.com/worldview-times/article.php?articleid=8228

    http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,343336,00.html

    BBC News Islam is the Fastest Growing Religion in London.

    and in this growing is by birth and by reverting ( for ur info most reverts r the women )

    actually brother Rahul , u and ur suppoters know the truth that ISLAM is the true way of life , but u denying it boz ur EGO and IGNORANT (that what EBLIS did too)

    zia syedJun 14, 2012

    Brother Rahul , I can give u the reply answers for every claim and misinterpreted u did , (most probably u already may know that) , but after that u will misquote or misinterpreted again and u will start pulling red-herring ……..but , why dont u first watch Yousf islam, Bilal phillipes ,Dr.zakir naik, or Ahmed deedat ….they already reply this nonsense long time ago

    Hopefully this info will help u to get heal form ur sickness, (INSHA”ALLAH) I will pray for ur sickness brother …..thx

    • Hey Zia,
      Currently I am busy in some other important work that is why I am unable to post anything new.. I will come back soon to debate with you..

      Regards..

      • Hello again Rahul,
        yah sound’s good to me , but don’t call it debate rather call it dialogues . Boz i know u have some good knowledge but lack of understanding so, we will work on that ….. so , INSH’ALLAH see u soon ….(if u contact me on google+ will much better ) …thx
        JAZAK’ALLAH khair

        • Hello Zia,

          Ok, you call it dilogues.. We will keep discussing until one of us understand what Quran really preaches.. And thanks for giving me time. I will contact on Google + as soon possible..Regards

          • No problem Bro, pleasure is mine……INSH’ALLAH we will do it
            waiting for ur time …..thx
            JAZAK’ALLAH khair

          • Bro Syed,

            Thanks for showing patience. Iam having my Graduation exams going on and it will end on 17th..
            So please wait till then. Thanking in advance..

            Regards

          • one more thing , an u plz take out that pic in (avatar) its look very ugly …..if nothing is there will b fine

    • Dear Syed,

      As I said, I’ll be free till 17th July, so I am back. Now please lets start our discussion. You can select any article for further discussion.

      Thanks.

      • Hello Rahul,
        Yha as u said u are here but u also said that u gonna contact me on google+ , which u didn’t , first thing ,we have to do this dialogues on google+ or any other social network of ur choice but not here , if u want u can post our discussion here , and second thing is This is the month of RAMADAN so, i wont get much for this but still i will try my best . and the last thing is we don’t have to choose any other article now, but u have to reply my questions which I posted to u in our discussion wich u took the excuse by saying (fallacy of Tu Quoque..)

        • Well Brother Syed,

          I am ready to have discussion on any Social Networking sites or on Google+. I know its month of Ramdan, so you can take your time, as for now we need to agree on any particular topic for our further discussion..

          Lastly, I’ll definitely leave my reply on Google+ to your previous replies..

          Regards..

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